Actuarial Outpost

Actuarial Outpost (http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/index.php)
-   Careers - Employment (http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/forumdisplay.php?f=18)
-   -   When your obligation starts? And employer ‘s? (http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/showthread.php?t=343753)

Afac_8 09-11-2019 03:46 PM

When your obligation starts? And employer ‘s?
 
In my relatively short experience at work (30’s), my job negotiations were complicated sometimes.
At the renewal, or before signing a contract, I look around for new opportunities. 2 times I was attacked and also offended by my employer / possible employer because I decided to change my mind denying the offer to sign for another company.

My intentions were always clear from the begging of the job negotiation saying that “other companies are interested in me”.
I think that until you sign a contract, you haven’t obligation.

The employer sometimes get mad and say that they thought that I would accept and that I am irresponsible and that I will never work in the industry.

Also, I put myself completely in the interviews when I am interested in a job. Maybe I should be less determined during interviews when I know that I could have other possibile offers? Do you think that sometimes employer exaggerate?

What’s your experience in changing job? Do you think that I am wrong and I should begin a negotiation in a different way?

I know that’s a complex subject to discuss, but it’s also a riddle for me.

NormalDan 09-11-2019 04:10 PM

What country are you in? In the US work is really at-will, so there's no contract.

Perhaps because of that I think it's quite reasonable for a person interviewing with a company to act like he's not solely interviewing with that company, I'd certainly strongly recommend anyone interviewing to see to interview in as many places as reasonable while looking until an offer is accepted/signed/etc. On more than one occasion I've been told by a company that it was a done deal only for them to pull the rug out for various reasons.

vesperka 09-11-2019 04:51 PM

If an employer only offers you a short-term contract, then they have no right to be upset if you walk away at the end of that contract. If that's an issue for them, then they should have offered you a longer contract or a permanent position to begin with.

When interviewing, you have no obligation to any company until you sign a contract. There's nothing wrong with you being passionate/excited during the interview process and then later rejecting an offer. There are many reasons why a reasonable person would turn down a job offer ever if they were truly passionate about the position itself.

In my experience, any person that gets angry and tells you that you'll never work in this industry again for turning down an offer is somebody that I wouldn't want to work for. I've had amazing candidates turn down offers from my company, and I know we'd hire them in a heartbeat given the chance.

As long as you're being upfront and honest with potential employers, I don't see any issue with how you're approaching the interviewing/negotiating process.

BruteForce 09-11-2019 04:56 PM

I had a boss once who said they'd never be certain that someone really accepted the job until the "employee" showed up for the first day. A lot can happen between accepting a job and the actual start date.

bjc2142 09-11-2019 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NormalDan (Post 9708779)
What country are you in? In the US work is really at-will, so there's no contract.

Perhaps because of that I think it's quite reasonable for a person interviewing with a company to act like he's not solely interviewing with that company, I'd certainly strongly recommend anyone interviewing to see to interview in as many places as reasonable while looking until an offer is accepted/signed/etc. On more than one occasion I've been told by a company that it was a done deal only for them to pull the rug out for various reasons.

how many days/weeks do companies usually give people to think about the offer? I feel like with full time job and other commitments, squeezing in on-site interviews to short time span is difficult and think one might have to pass on the earlier offers with uncertainty that the candidate may not get job offer from subsequent interviews.

NormalDan 09-11-2019 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjc2142 (Post 9708861)
how many days/weeks do companies usually give people to think about the offer? I feel like with full time job and other commitments, squeezing in on-site interviews to short time span is difficult and think one might have to pass on the earlier offers with uncertainty that the candidate may not get job offer from subsequent interviews.

It takes a bit of managing. If a company has straight up given you an offer I think you can push it like a week, little bit of delay then mention a potential other offer sort of thing. When I dealt with this somewhat recently it was basically this.. manage the lead up time and then they give an offer on Friday, you get back on Monday say you'll think about it but have another final round interview, then Wednesday respond sort of thing.

It's mainly I wouldn't call off other interviews or stop seeking new interviews merely because you're about to get an offer, basically keep sprinting right through the finish line.

bjc2142 09-11-2019 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NormalDan (Post 9708880)
It takes a bit of managing. If a company has straight up given you an offer I think you can push it like a week, little bit of delay then mention a potential other offer sort of thing. When I dealt with this somewhat recently it was basically this.. manage the lead up time and then they give an offer on Friday, you get back on Monday say you'll think about it but have another final round interview, then Wednesday respond sort of thing.

It's mainly I wouldn't call off other interviews or stop seeking new interviews merely because you're about to get an offer, basically keep sprinting right through the finish line.

sounds like stressful thing to do :shudder:

Afac_8 09-11-2019 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NormalDan (Post 9708880)
It takes a bit of managing. If a company has straight up given you an offer I think you can push it like a week, little bit of delay then mention a potential other offer sort of thing. When I dealt with this somewhat recently it was basically this.. manage the lead up time and then they give an offer on Friday, you get back on Monday say you'll think about it but have another final round interview, then Wednesday respond sort of thing.

It's mainly I wouldn't call off other interviews or stop seeking new interviews merely because you're about to get an offer, basically keep sprinting right through the finish line.


Ok, this is why some employer could get mad (in my experience, no US): taking time and then saying you have another offer.

Vorian Atreides 09-12-2019 09:24 AM

+1 on not changing anything until you have accepted an offer and have something in writing supporting that offer and acceptance.

Dr T Non-Fan 09-12-2019 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Afac_8 (Post 9709003)
Ok, this is why some employer could get mad (in my experience, no US): taking time and then saying you have another offer.

Humblebrag about getting multiple offers.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:38 AM.

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Page generated in 0.23085 seconds with 9 queries